Serious General christian thread

[Yes]

total pagan conversion

 

[Yes]

ev&oe tradcath and tradorthodox are larps

thats only on the internet

 

[Pepsilord]

europe had more wars than any other continent in human history. we also were more graceful than your brethren. you shot first, not us.

>The Continent with one of the most thoroughly documented histories has evidence of many wars
What a shocker

 

[baqqrih]

europe had more wars than any other continent in human history

I do not care, and I don't know what this proves. Christianity isn't a European religion. Meanwhile, your religion was tearing your own people's organs out and it only awarded you with complete domination by the Papists over the lands that were apparently blessed by your gods. I don't know what reward the Aztecs got from those sacrifices besides being utterly crushed.

we also were more graceful than your brethren. you shot first, not us.

Yeah, very graceful to have a culture built on human sacrifice. If your religion advocates for the ritualistic murder of innocent people, including children, I don't know how you expect that to be seen as graceful. I certainly don't like all of how the Papists dealt with the New World, since, of course, I view them as having spread a false heresy that still harms Latin American Christians today, and I believe that some of their conquests held within them unnecessary violence, but I'm rather certain they were justified in their conquest when they saw the horrible traditions of murder that were coming out of the Aztec lands. Not the specific facets of indiscriminate mass destruction and death from that conquest (which is where things could have been handled far better), but the conquest itself.

they blessed us with gifts for every sacrifice.

Yeah, their greatest gift was running away from your people and leaving you to a governing force that wasn't constantly stabbing babies to death. I doubt "every sacrifice" was so blessed if the Aztecs crumbled in their end.

mexicayotl is rising tremendously and church attendance is at a decline

Once again, I don't care. All that's telling me is that the world is descending further into evil, as prophesied for the end times. Homosexuality is becoming more common, too, but I'm sure we can both understand that a simple rise in something doesn't make it good.

we are more hygienic than europeans are. the europeans brought diseases to the new world because of their unsanitary practices.

I don't really know what that has to do with what I've said. I'm arguing that your gods abandoned you and your sacrifices were worthless as displayed by that mass destruction from things like disease, which the barbaric human sacrifice tradition of your religion did nothing in resolving, meanwhile you're just calling White people stinky and unsanitary. This isn't supposed to be a racial conversation when we're in a thread about religion.

ah yes, no hate like christian love.

Completely correct. I hate your false religion and I think anyone who follows it is greatly deceived. No disagreement there.

 

[Soygoy]

I hate your false religion

Not exactly the most fond of your false religion either.

 

[Spasoje's Revenge]

ah yes, no hate like christian love.

>Christian love should be when you tolerate child sacrifice and are too spineless to stand up for your own principles and speak truth, don't you know Jesus was a socialist or something?

 

[baqqrih]

Not exactly the most fond of your false religion either.

Okay? I understand that, and I'm not sure where you're coming in with this statement. He's saying I wasn't being loving in my display of clear criticism to his religion, I agreed by acknowledging that I hate his religion, and now you've presented a criticism towards my faith, which I also comprehend, in that everyone is capable of disliking religions. You can dislike things all you want, and I understand you aren't a Christian. It isn't really proving any point. I'm only really confused with why you felt the need to say this.

 

[Soygoy]

Okay? I understand that, and I'm not sure where you're coming in with this statement. He's saying I wasn't being loving in my display of clear criticism to his religion, I agreed by acknowledging that I hate his religion, and now you've presented a criticism towards my faith, which I also comprehend, in that everyone is capable of disliking religions. You can dislike things all you want, and I understand you aren't a Christian. It isn't really proving any point. I'm only really confused with why you felt the need to say this.

It was a joke. I find Christians fighting everyone to be funny regardless.

 

[baqqrih]

It was a joke. I find Christians fighting everyone to be funny regardless.

Ah, alright, haha.

 

[DonutHole]

You should be thankful. I entirely agree with that Indian's assumption. The blessing of our Christ's gospel is the only thing that gave your dirty land, stained with the blood of innocent people, a civilization that wasn't wrapped up in rampant barbarity. Why do you think your pathetic, animal gods gave you up to an actual Lord? Was it not out of fear? Did the arrival of truth shake them awake and send them fleeing? Did you not tear enough hearts out of people? Perhaps a few more hearts ripped out of your own fellow people's bodies would work. Maybe your own heart would work even better, so how about you try tearing it out, and see how your demons react, then, since that's all the value you have in their eyes; a simple sacrifice to be done and made nothing of afterwards. Maybe they'd like you more if you continued this forsakening of your actual Lord, Lord Jesus, and wouldn't you just love to finally appease your cowardly, weak, jaguar-headed idols after they let disease ravage your homes and your people? Go on, then, try a few more rituals, and they'll just save everything, won't they! Just more blood, that's all that'll solve it, isn't it? What a strong religion you have, to begin collapsing immediately as Christ's blessing of the gospel arrived on your disbelieving shores! You're a blatant fool.

The pre-columbian civilization was far less barbarous. Before, we had an actual waste management system. Afterwards we inherited the european practice of dumping our shit out of our windows. This caused an explosion of dystenery, killing countless every year. The former capital of science, mathematics, philosophy and art was turned into just another massive resource extraction slave labor colony. The effects of that and the caste system damned hundreds of millions to poverty and caused hundreds of rebellions, caste wars, revolts. The biggest of which being the Revolution of 1910 which was the bloodiest war in the Americas ever. What's a couple thousand dead to ritual every year compared to the millions dead due to famine, poverty, slavery, persecution, war and disease. There is no solid "humanist" argument for the conquest. It objectively caused more human suffering than if the empire stayed.

Not to mention the effects of the church. Just a simple crash course: Catholic Hardliners loyal to the church were encouraged to centralize the state under Santa Ana, the state was unable to effectively exert it's authority due to the extremely hard to navigate nature of Mexico. With a giant mountain range splitting the country and no navigable rivers. This culminated in many rebellions, the independence of Texas and the Mexican-American war.

The Church encouraged people to openly rebel from the government after the liberal constitution of 1857 was passed which limited the power of the church(removed it's status as state religion, established secular education and forced the sale of all church property), introduced individual rights such as freedom of speech, assembly, universal male suffrage, federalism etc. It was Mexico's bourgeoisie constitution which solidified the country's transition from feudalism to capitalism. This led to a bloody 3 year long civil war which destroyed the country's infrastructure and sucked the reserves dry.

The conservatives came back a couple years later with the French as their allies. Hoping to establish a catholic monarchy puppet state. This war was of course blessed by the pope. It caused another 5 year long war.

Years later, the serf-like status that the indigenous people had to endure culminated in the 10 year long revolution that gripped all aspects of Mexican society. 2.7 million people died, in a country that had a population of 15 million at the time. It was the boiling point of over a century of resentment. The secular, socialist government that emerged propelled the country into a massive economic boom, it nationalized the industries which were stolen by foreigners and instituted sweeping land reforms which increased quality of life. It further limited the rights of the church, in response the church rallied for another civil war. Finally emerging from this last war, the church was never the same. Some of which still survive to this day

-All churches built before 1992 are considered national patrimony and are fully owned by the state
-All churches built after 1992 are owned by their respective religious organization, but are subject to taxation
-No religious ceremonies are allowed outside places of worship without a government issued permit for that event. Religious ceremonies conducted outside of places of worship are subject to regulatory law
-Members of the clergy forfeit their right to participate in government, advocate for partisan political views, support political candidates and cannot publicly oppose the laws or institutions of the state
-Religious associations may not hold political meetings of any kind or own or operate radio or television stations
-Government permission is required for commercial television or radio to transmit religious programming
-Socialist education until 1930s, when it was replaced by Secular education

Before, from 1930's to 1992, the laws were much harsher. In that time the church's influence waned dramatically. Nowadays, there can be more leniency since there is almost 0 church influence and therefore no risk of church interference.

What's funny is that from this I can draw a parallel between what you said about the old gods instantly collapsing and "the lord" instantly collapsing once independence was achieved. "Just pray harder bro!!! Im sure jesus will intervene right before you're about to be martyred"

Also humorous is the distinction you place between the old and new faith. The lines are extremely blurred since the spanish themselves didn't care how heretical we were as long as there was a facade of faith to keep the empire stable. The mass conversion of the Mexicans only happened after a brown marian apparition in the same hill where the former temple to Tonantzin (Our Lady), afterwards they just accepted her as an aspect of the former deity known as Tonantzin Coatlaxopeuh (Our Lady who emerges from the light like the Eagle from fire). If you look beyond the surface level, Mexicans never completely got rid of their former faith. They just dressed it up with abrahamic elements.

 

[Imperator]

View attachment 1729462131129.png
Thoughts on the People's Salvation Cathedral in Romania wich is going to be the biggest Orthodox cathedral in the world?

 

[Yes]

View attachment 57975
Thoughts on the People's Salvation Cathedral in Romania wich is going to be the biggest Orthodox cathedral in the world?

looks nice

 

[baqqrih]

The pre-columbian civilization was far less barbarous. Before, we had an actual waste management system. Afterwards we inherited the european practice of dumping our shit out of our windows. This caused an explosion of dystenery, killing countless every year. The former capital of science, mathematics, philosophy and art was turned into just another massive resource extraction slave labor colony. The effects of that and the caste system damned hundreds of millions to poverty and caused hundreds of rebellions, caste wars, revolts. The biggest of which being the Revolution of 1910 which was the bloodiest war in the Americas ever. What's a couple thousand dead to ritual every year compared to the millions dead due to famine, poverty, slavery, persecution, war and disease. There is no solid "humanist" argument for the conquest. It objectively caused more human suffering than if the empire stayed.

Not to mention the effects of the church. Just a simple crash course: Catholic Hardliners loyal to the church were encouraged to centralize the state under Santa Ana, the state was unable to effectively exert it's authority due to the extremely hard to navigate nature of Mexico. With a giant mountain range splitting the country and no navigable rivers. This culminated in many rebellions, the independence of Texas and the Mexican-American war.

The Church encouraged people to openly rebel from the government after the liberal constitution of 1857 was passed which limited the power of the church(removed it's status as state religion, established secular education and forced the sale of all church property), introduced individual rights such as freedom of speech, assembly, universal male suffrage, federalism etc. It was Mexico's bourgeoisie constitution which solidified the country's transition from feudalism to capitalism. This led to a bloody 3 year long civil war which destroyed the country's infrastructure and sucked the reserves dry.

The conservatives came back a couple years later with the French as their allies. Hoping to establish a catholic monarchy puppet state. This war was of course blessed by the pope. It caused another 5 year long war.

Years later, the serf-like status that the indigenous people had to endure culminated in the 10 year long revolution that gripped all aspects of Mexican society. 2.7 million people died, in a country that had a population of 15 million at the time. It was the boiling point of over a century of resentment. The secular, socialist government that emerged propelled the country into a massive economic boom, it nationalized the industries which were stolen by foreigners and instituted sweeping land reforms which increased quality of life. It further limited the rights of the church, in response the church rallied for another civil war. Finally emerging from this last war, the church was never the same. Some of which still survive to this day

-All churches built before 1992 are considered national patrimony and are fully owned by the state
-All churches built after 1992 are owned by their respective religious organization, but are subject to taxation
-No religious ceremonies are allowed outside places of worship without a government issued permit for that event. Religious ceremonies conducted outside of places of worship are subject to regulatory law
-Members of the clergy forfeit their right to participate in government, advocate for partisan political views, support political candidates and cannot publicly oppose the laws or institutions of the state
-Religious associations may not hold political meetings of any kind or own or operate radio or television stations
-Government permission is required for commercial television or radio to transmit religious programming
-Socialist education until 1930s, when it was replaced by Secular education

Before, from 1930's to 1992, the laws were much harsher. In that time the church's influence waned dramatically. Nowadays, there can be more leniency since there is almost 0 church influence and therefore no risk of church interference.

What's funny is that from this I can draw a parallel between what you said about the old gods instantly collapsing and "the lord" instantly collapsing once independence was achieved.

Also humorous is the distinction you place between the old and new faith. The lines are extremely blurred since the spanish themselves didn't care how heretical we were as long as there was a facade of faith to keep the empire stable. The mass conversion of the Mexicans only happened after a brown marian apparition in the same hill where the former temple to Tonantzin (Our Lady), afterwards they just accepted her as an aspect of the former deity known as Tonantzin Coatlaxopeuh (Our Lady who emerges from the light like the Eagle from fire). If you look beyond the surface level, Mexicans never completely got rid of their former faith. They just dressed it up with abrahamic elements.

I thank you for pointing out the issues of the Catholic conquering of the Amerindian lands. A lot of what you have outlined here would have been similar to what I would have pointed out if I were asked about the particulars of my issues with the Catholics taking control of the New World. Lots of cruelty there, and that heretical syncretism, too.

 

[Yes]

catholics sometimes do weird stuff like putting people into residential schools and also some of the priests are massive pedos but a good chunk of them are good people

 

[DonutHole]

I thank you for pointing out the issues of the Catholic conquering of the Amerindian lands. A lot of what you have outlined here would have been similar to what I would have pointed out if I were asked about the particulars of my issues with the Catholics taking control of the New World. Lots of cruelty there.

Most of the conflicts of the post-independence era was just power struggles between state and church. The church resisted any attempts to have it dislodged from political power and the state would not accept the church as a pillar of governance.

 

[DonutHole]

Most of the conflicts of the post-independence era was just power struggles between state and church. The church resisted any attempts to have it dislodged from political power and the state would not accept the church as a pillar of governance.

Which obviously is the fault of the church. Especially since all the times they did ever have power were disastrous.

 

[bnwoclitty]

niggerwave

 

[Goot]

I hate the antichrist

 

[Ree Vannin]

 

[Pepsilord]

Do Catholicxisters really?