The Protestant idea of "faith alone" is stupid

FAGGOT!!!!!!!!!!!!

FAGGOT!!!!!!!!!!!!

WARNING!!!!!! THIS USER SUCKS COCKS!!!!!
QUEER OF THE YEAR!!!!!!!!
"What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them? Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food.If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.
...
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder."
(James 2:14-17, 18b-19)
 
78174 - SoyBooru.png
 
Orthodoxy adheres to a very compelling doctrine on the question. We affirm that salvation cannot be earned through works, that salvation is a gift from God, a merciful, unearned gift. But we need to accept this gift of salvation. We can of course reject it, but rejecting doesn't just mean saying "I don't believe in Christ". Every sin is rejection of this gift and a rejection of God. Every time we sin we erect barriers between us and God, we reject Him. So then we need to work on tearing down these self imposed barriers, through prayer, repentance, communion, confession etc. This is how we accept God's gift. You cannot simply claim to accept it and go on doing whatever. If you wish to be glorified by God's energies you must draw near to him, he won't force you, it's on you to accept salvation.
 
Spas said:
Orthodoxy adheres to a very compelling doctrine on the question. We affirm that salvation cannot be earned through works, that salvation is a gift from God, a merciful, unearned gift. But we need to accept this gift of salvation. We can of course reject it, but rejecting doesn't just mean saying "I don't believe in Christ". Every sin is rejection of this gift and a rejection of God. Every time we sin we erect barriers between us and God, we reject Him. So then we need to work on tearing down these self imposed barriers, through prayer, repentance, communion, confession etc. This is how we accept God's gift. You cannot simply claim to accept it and go on doing whatever. If you wish to be glorified by God's energies you must draw near to him, he won't force you, it's on you to accept salvation.
Click to expand...
I've heard some Protestant responses to confession and reconciliation be that "why would we need confession and reconciliation when Jesus already died to forgive us of our sins?" or "why do we need to tell our sins to a priest for them to be forgiven; can't we go directly to God?" What yould your counterarguments be? I would say for the first one that Jesus died to take away our original sin; we still need to make an effort to get back in communion with God. For the second one, I would say that God is forgiving us through the priest.
 
encrusting_acro said:
I've heard some Protestant responses to confession and reconciliation be that "why would we need confession and reconciliation when Jesus already died to forgive us of our sins?" or "why do we need to tell our sins to a priest for them to be forgiven; can't we go directly to God?" What yould your counterarguments be? I would say for the first one that Jesus died to take away our original sin; we still need to make an effort to get back in communion with God. For the second one, I would say that God is forgiving us through the priest.
Click to expand...
Well the Orthodox Church simply doesn't believe in the penal substitution, that's a uniquely western idea. For one we don't believe in the inheritance of guilt of the original sin, we merely inherit the fallen state of the world, therefore we don't need to be absolved of a sin for which we are not guilty. And Christ's sacrifice isn't seen as substitutionary, that's to say it isn't seen as him being substituted for humanity to satisfy Father's wrath. Christ in the Bible is likened to the sacrificial lamb, and as a lamb that gets sacrificed gets eaten, so do we eat the body and blood of Christ after his sacrifice. It's really not a matter of what argument I could make, but how well I could explain the doctrine. But if we're really going with "Christ bore Father's wrath to appease the Father so he could forgive everyone" then how are the unbelievers not forgiven? Because they haven't "accepted" the "payment"? It's just such a convoluted, arbitrary idea.
As for confession, why don't you just ask God to read the Bible for you too? Why not ask him exactly what to do? Why not ask him exactly what to think? Why not ask him the winning lottery numbers? You'll find God isn't much of a conversationalist, despite being ever present, and how do you confess something to One that already knows everything? I think it's pretty clear, confession to a priest is a lot more dreadful of a prospect than confession to a quiet God that already knows all of your sins, who's reaction you don't have to see and who's words you don't have to hear. I imagine it will be a lot more dreadful than confessing to any person once it's time to confess right before him, on judgement day, so better confess as much as possible while here...
 
Spas said:
Orthodoxy adheres to a very compelling doctrine on the question. We affirm that salvation cannot be earned through works, that salvation is a gift from God, a merciful, unearned gift. But we need to accept this gift of salvation. We can of course reject it, but rejecting doesn't just mean saying "I don't believe in Christ". Every sin is rejection of this gift and a rejection of God. Every time we sin we erect barriers between us and God, we reject Him. So then we need to work on tearing down these self imposed barriers, through prayer, repentance, communion, confession etc. This is how we accept God's gift. You cannot simply claim to accept it and go on doing whatever. If you wish to be glorified by God's energies you must draw near to him, he won't force you, it's on you to accept salvation.
Click to expand...
Spas said:
Well the Orthodox Church simply doesn't believe in the penal substitution, that's a uniquely western idea. For one we don't believe in the inheritance of guilt of the original sin, we merely inherit the fallen state of the world, therefore we don't need to be absolved of a sin for which we are not guilty. And Christ's sacrifice isn't seen as substitutionary, that's to say it isn't seen as him being substituted for humanity to satisfy Father's wrath. Christ in the Bible is likened to the sacrificial lamb, and as a lamb that gets sacrificed gets eaten, so do we eat the body and blood of Christ after his sacrifice. It's really not a matter of what argument I could make, but how well I could explain the doctrine. But if we're really going with "Christ bore Father's wrath to appease the Father so he could forgive everyone" then how are the unbelievers not forgiven? Because they haven't "accepted" the "payment"? It's just such a convoluted, arbitrary idea.
As for confession, why don't you just ask God to read the Bible for you too? Why not ask him exactly what to do? Why not ask him exactly what to think? Why not ask him the winning lottery numbers? You'll find God isn't much of a conversationalist, despite being ever present, and how do you confess something to One that already knows everything? I think it's pretty clear, confession to a priest is a lot more dreadful of a prospect than confession to a quiet God that already knows all of your sins, who's reaction you don't have to see and who's words you don't have to hear. I imagine it will be a lot more dreadful than confessing to any person once it's time to confess right before him, on judgement day, so better confess as much as possible while here...
Click to expand...
Once again, the way you type these things out makes me really want to move to a town with an Eastern Orthodox (hopefully ROCOR) church when I grow up and move out of the house. It all makes so much sense from this perspective.
 
Currently the best protestant retorts I've heard on the entire site:
>you're pagan
>that's an adhominem
>*Jartycuck react*
>"drink the kool aid"
 
Malzy_Moo said:
Will drink the kool aid award
Click to expand...
I'm still unsure, of course, and am currently remaining a Baptist as my family is, but how can you refute, for example, what was just explained about faith and works? As far as I'm understanding it, salvation is, of course, unearned, and is purely God's gift to us sinners, yet the works of the church doctrine are practices that can let us remove what makes us reject The Lord. They don't get us to salvation directly through doing them, but they (works instated by the practices and doctrine of the church) are like medicine to fight off the symptoms (sin) of a terminal illness (our sinful nature) that will ultimately only be ridden of through a cure (Christ's gift).
 
baqqrih said:
I'm still unsure, of course, and am currently remaining a Baptist as my family is, but how can you refute, for example, what was just explained about faith and works? As far as I'm understanding it, salvation is, of course, unearned, and is purely God's gift to us sinners, yet the works of the church doctrine are practices that can let us remove what makes us reject The Lord.
Click to expand...
1721081578422k-1.png


Last time we did stuff for the church we got the abomination known as the Catholic Church. I don’t think it ever ends up well.
 

Attachments

  • neutralplier.png
    neutralplier.png
    43.1 KB · Views: 17
Malzy_Moo said:
View attachment 19610

Last time we did stuff for the church we got the abomination known as the Catholic Church. I don’t think it ever ends up well.
Click to expand...
Just as the Catholics "did stuff" and got to their abomination, as you say, what then can you say of the Russian Orthodox Church? Where has the "stuff" gotten it, in comparison to the heresies of even our own Protestant denominations, which have reached a similar level of such widespread mistruths through doing no "stuff" for any institution? Just look at the horrible lies being preached today here in your every-day, average American church, these "Christian Zionist" Judaizers in our pulpits, for example. It's absolutely terrible.
 
baqqrih said:
Just as the Catholics "did stuff" and got to their abomination, as you say, what then can you say of the Russian Orthodox Church? Where has the "stuff" gotten it, in comparison to the heresies of even our own Protestant denominations, which have reached a similar level of such widespread mistruths through doing no "stuff" for any institution? Just look at the horrible lies being preached today here in your every-day, average American church, these "Christian Zionist" Judaizers in our pulpits, for example. It's absolutely terrible.
Click to expand...
The Orthodox Church doesn’t do much except beg for money and buy expensive watches, also Protestants have done much community work. Nobody says this.
 
Malzy_Moo said:
The Orthodox Church doesn’t do much except beg for money and buy expensive watches, also Protestants have done much community work. Nobody says this.
Click to expand...
The Orthodox Church does what it needs to do, preserve the truth and provide the Church service and 7 holy mysteries. It isn't a soup kitchen, though it may provide charity to the poor, it is not its prime objective. It's prime objective is providing people with tools for salvation and preserving holy wisdom, you cannot make the Church cure all the ills of the world because the Church fundamentally works with the other worldly, it isn't a charity.
>but they beg for money
Who do you think pays for the priest service and Church maintenance? It's the Church goers.
>but this priest has an expensive watch
Are priests not allowed to wear watches?
>but that priest has an expensive car
Are priests supposed to ride in junk cars? A priest is a respected figure, do you imagine a medieval priest, adorned in his robes, riding on a strong, white horse or riding on a donkey?
But none of this is neither here nor there as none of this pertains to what's the ultimate question, which is: Does the Orthodox Church hold Holy authority And does it preserve the Holy truth?
 
Spas said:
The Orthodox Church does what it needs to do, preserve the truth and provide the Church service and 7 holy mysteries. It isn't a soup kitchen, though it may provide charity to the poor, it is not its prime objective. It's prime objective is providing people with tools for salvation and preserving holy wisdom, you cannot make the Church cure all the ills of the world because the Church fundamentally works with the other worldly, it isn't a charity.
>but they beg for money
Who do you think pays for the priest service and Church maintenance? It's the Church goers.
>but this priest has an expensive watch
Are priests not allowed to wear watches?
>but that priest has an expensive car
Are priests supposed to ride in junk cars? A priest is a respected figure, do you imagine a medieval priest, adorned in his robes, riding on a strong, white horse or riding on a donkey?
But none of this is neither here nor there as none of this pertains to what's the ultimate question, which is: Does the Orthodox Church hold Holy authority And does it preserve the Holy truth?
Click to expand...
Would you let God fuck your wife? Hypothetically of course.
 

Similar threads

baqqrih
  • Poll
VOTE! What is your faith?
8 9 10
Replies
192
Views
5K
baqqrih
baqqrih
DonutHole
Geniune question about Catholicism, I'm curious about the faith.
Replies
8
Views
216
Brainstorm
B
Soynic Hedgehog
Secular thoughts on faith and why the faithless should envy the faithful
Replies
1
Views
139
Spas
S
Back
Top